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2024/02/10 M9.04 CME


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3 minutes ago, Philalethes said:

There's certainly truth to this, but I guess the most interesting situations that are usually referred to is when an even bigger snowplow comes up behind at double the mass and speed, and is then followed by a huge bulldozer with a turbomotor, at which point you get some rather interesting results (and usually some of the most complex magnetic field structures when they do end up passing us).

I wish there was a reasonable way to simulated such events as this. I want to see what sort of effects the 1972 CME and the 2003 CME's were to have on our magnetosphere and other near-space regions. Once again I digress.

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On 2/11/2024 at 2:12 PM, Philalethes said:

Yeah, I see they are modeling an even smaller angle than what I assumed from the dimming; using that angle of ~22.5° (rough estimate from looking at the model) combined with the latest imagery I'd say arrival would be as little as ~44 hours after launch, which would correspond to 02-13T19Z, but of course with uncertainty. Seems to correspond with their time, but from experience that's not exactly that reliable.

Edit:

Actually, scratch that; I realize now the launch was actually on the 10th, so clearly I'm greatly overestimating the speed, as I'd get almost a full day earlier than the above model.

I just tried again, this time to apply the speed I measured from LASCO to the bulk as seen in the imagery above, at around an angle of 30° instead, and now I'm getting values much more in agreement with what I see in the forecasts, with a speed of ~900 km/s and a transit time of ~54 hours. That's actually the same as the estimate I made in the previous post, heh; also seems to be in good agreement with the others (arrival between 02-13T05Z and 02-13T17Z instead, to account for me getting the day wrong).

what exactly does 02-13T17Z mean? february 13th 17:00 UTC or it doesn't refer to time?

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10 minutes ago, willow said:

what exactly does 02-13T17Z mean? february 13th 17:00 UTC or it doesn't refer to time?

5 minutes ago, MinYoongi said:

you got it right. Z=Zulu (UTC

Yep, exactly that. Just the most compact way to write it while still making it clear that it's UTC (although in discussions like this it would probably be fairly obvious anyway).

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6 hours ago, Parabolic said:

I wish there was a reasonable way to simulated such events as this. I want to see what sort of effects the 1972 CME and the 2003 CME's were to have on our magnetosphere and other near-space regions. Once again I digress.

you might wish to view this at your leisure @Parabolic  Tamitha Skov is an excellent scientist imho and a Ham coincidentally haha. She models and discusses the 1972 event in depth here.  Hopefully this is half as interesting to you as it was to me.  Mike. 

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5 minutes ago, hamateur 1953 said:

you might wish to view this at your leisure @Parabolic  Tamitha Skov is an excellent scientist imho and a Ham coincidentally haha. She models and discusses the 1972 event in depth here.  Hopefully this is half as interesting to you as it was to me.  Mike. 

She's actually the one who inspired me to study flare dynamics and plasma physics! I'm currently doing my second run through all of her courses. I didn't retain as much education as I would like so this time I'm writing down everything I should know. Are you by chance a member of her mini course patreon?

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23 minutes ago, Parabolic said:

She's actually the one who inspired me to study flare dynamics and plasma physics! I'm currently doing my second run through all of her courses. I didn't retain as much education as I would like so this time I'm writing down everything I should know. Are you by chance a member of her mini course patreon?

No, unfortunately I am not. Just a fellow Ham who was actually informed of her existence on this site!  Haha. Glad to have ya aboard!  Mike. 

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3 hours ago, tniickck said:

it seems to arrive a bit later than expected or not to arrive at all

there was a discussion yesterday and the possible arrival is today at 17 utc. let's hope it's true!

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6 hours ago, tniickck said:

it seems to arrive a bit later than expected or not to arrive at all

2 hours ago, willow said:

there was a discussion yesterday and the possible arrival is today at 17 utc. let's hope it's true!

Most predictions on CME Scoreboard seem to be centered between 10Z and 17Z, so I'm thinking we'll see signs of it within the next ~6 hours or so. Pretty bad timing for aurora watchers if that's the case, but if it's on the later end of that spectrum maybe it can get dark enough in places like Europe and Russia wherever skies are clear. I guess if it arrives seconds after I post this it could work for people on the west coast of the US too (or people in East/Southeast Asia or Australia for that matter).

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34 minutes ago, Jesterface23 said:

The EPAMp 47-68keV line is holding around 200k after the impact late last night. Something still seems to be coming.

I agree, there's only been very minor enhancements in the solar wind.My guess those are just the transient effects from all the other activity that wasn't directed at earth.

I'm certainly expecting a decent shock arrival well passed 20bt reaching at least 30bt-40bt. Since it will probably hit before dark (I'm located in the Northern Plains USA) a deviation of 80nt-120nt at 40°lat. (Boulder is my closest magnetometer) is what I expect. I might be a little too hopeful but I usually am in these scenarios.

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So likely g2 higher latitude g1 at lower latitude posilby

14 hours ago, Kayla Bisson said:

Nathan you keep asking if you should be worried and if you aren't going to believe NASA or the many times we've already told you there's nothing we're going to say that will suddenly convince you to join ALL of us here and enjoy it. This isn't the thread but lets put this to bed, what exactly are you worried about happening? If you list your fears I'm sure lots of us here can point you in the direction of some reliable information that can help educate you and hopefully help your anxiety.

 

*edit I hope my tone isn't rude I just hoping to ease some distress

Your good you weren’t being rude sorry I didn’t get back to you sooner I’m worried about these geomagnetic storms knocking the satellites to the ground I know it probably won’t happen and the power going out and possible nuclear meltdown even though they have the measures 

You weren’t a jerk

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33 minutes ago, Nathan Majors said:

So likely g2 higher latitude g1 at lower latitude posilby

Your good you weren’t being rude sorry I didn’t get back to you sooner I’m worried about these geomagnetic storms knocking the satellites to the ground I know it probably won’t happen and the power going out and possible nuclear meltdown even though they have the measures 

You weren’t a jerk

satellites are being lost when a really strong flares occur, like, for example, the october-november 2003 ones, which is super rare. a CME impact from M9 flare isn't that strong, it's going to be ok, don't worry

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25 minutes ago, MinYoongi said:

what do you base this on?

These are just my expectations based on the estimated density and speed then comparing it to similar recent events. Like I said, I'm usually a little  hopeful haha. 

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3 hours ago, Jesterface23 said:

The EPAMp 47-68keV line is holding around 200k after the impact late last night. Something still seems to be coming.

There was also a coincident sustained boost in Bt measured by ACE.  Could this have been the solar wind from the transient coronal hole produced by this flare?  Or the later filament eruption to the south?  Lots of options on the buffet.

Edited by Drax Spacex
IMF
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