Solar-Terrestrial Coupling (2)

[Newbie]

This topic was first posted on July 30th 2020 by Javier. He posed the question whether this diagram, (given that it was 20 years old), was still an accurate representation of what is known about the effect of the Sun, (and cosmic rays), on the Earth. A lot of argy-bargy ensued so I thought I would post the topic again, (apologies to Javier), rather than post in the original.

I hope this might lead to a discussion about how the Sun's magnetic fields, energised particles and xrays etc. couple with the magnetosphere and the Earth's ionosphere to produce auroras(e). Perhaps some new research that has come to light. There may be new info about muons or solar storms causing ground currents. All Sun-Earth effects.

...... is it still an accurate representation?

 

 

 

[Christopher S.]

3 hours ago, Newbie said:

This topic was first posted on July 30th 2020 by Javier. He posed the question whether this diagram, (given that it was 20 years old), was still an accurate representation of what is known about the effect of the Sun, (and cosmic rays), on the Earth. A lot of argy-bargy ensued so I thought I would post the topic again, (apologies to Javier), rather than post in the original.

I hope this might lead to a discussion about how the Sun's magnetic fields, energised particles and xrays etc. couple with the magnetosphere and the Earth's ionosphere to produce auroras(e). Perhaps some new research that has come to light. There may be new info about muons or solar storms causing ground currents. All Sun-Earth effects.

...... is it still an accurate representation?

 

 

 

Mostly. It is missing information by nature of being a simplified diagram. It's also idealized to some extent; there are scenarios in which Gamma rays can(and historically have) reached the surface. Radio emission events are missing above. It's a good diagram if this is your first time hearing about any of the above phenomena and need some manner of visual interpretation to understand the concepts, but the concepts themselves are entirely absent(i.e. what goes on within each block? what exactly is being represented by the arrows? so on and so forth)

[helios]

That is a handy chart.

Additionally to what Christopher said, also energetic particles can directly affect the atmosphere, if their energy is high enough ("vertical cut-off rigidity").

"Protons with energies greater than approximately 450 MeV can generate a nuclear cascade that can penetrate to the surface of Earth in the polar regions. It takes approximately 15 GeV of energy to penetrate through Earth’s magnetosphere in the equatorial regions and then generate the nuclear cascades in the atmosphere such that an increase above the cosmic radiation background intensity can be detected by cosmic ray instrumentation."
(Space Weather and the Ground-Level Solar Proton Events of the 23rd Solar Cycle by M.A. Shea and D.F. Smart)

[Christopher S.]

1 uur terug, helios zei:

That is a handy chart.

Additionally to what Christopher said, also energetic particles can directly affect the atmosphere, if their energy is high enough ("vertical cut-off rigidity").

"Protons with energies greater than approximately 450 MeV can generate a nuclear cascade that can penetrate to the surface of Earth in the polar regions. It takes approximately 15 GeV of energy to penetrate through Earth’s magnetosphere in the equatorial regions and then generate the nuclear cascades in the atmosphere such that an increase above the cosmic radiation background intensity can be detected by cosmic ray instrumentation."
(Space Weather and the Ground-Level Solar Proton Events of the 23rd Solar Cycle by M.A. Shea and D.F. Smart)

Yes, very good example of the subtext necessary to understand what the flow chart is attempting to convey. That said, due to the exceptions to said chart I would say it is not very useful as an educational tool. If it was titled "Common associations between Sun and Earth" I'd give it a passing grade. It does not represent all associations, and those it does lack detail or omit the exceptions to what may be interpreted as rule, asserted in the chart itself.

[Kuhnate]

It would be fair to say there should be a separate box off of magnetic fields. The modulation of things like north Atlantic Oscillation, el Nina / Nino, etc aren't shown. 

[Newbie]

Yes! thank you for your replies Christopher S. and Helios. Much appreciated! Out of respect for the original author, whose topic I was re-posting, I didn't want to start the conversation by criticising the diagram per se, but rather use it as a starting point with which to build a discussion upon, as you both have done. Perhaps fleshing out the missing subtexts and omissions that would give everyone a greater understanding of Solar-Terrestial coupling. I quickly listed a few things that came to mind as I am interested in learning more about the 'connectivity' between the Sun and the Earth.

So I ask how else can this be built upon?

PS: In my opinion the topic heading didn't match the diagram either, but I have also posted a topic heading that was confusing and didn't fit with what I wanted to say, so no judgment there.  😅

 

Edited July 27, 2021 by Newbie

[Christopher S.]

1 hour ago, Newbie said:

So I ask how else can this be built upon?

Well, as you said, fleshing it out would improve the information conveyed somewhat. The simplified version here is quite easy to interpret and digest - there is no complex information to it. Perhaps it would be useful to use this image to ease someone into the more complex version we're imagining here.

I can see such things having a home in college textbooks. Those will have charts and then some. Unfortunately however, they're expensive and the images within I believe can not be scanned and reposted elsewhere, legally anyways.

So, using the original chart above as a reference, if you care to create your own to practice your comprehension of the associations between the stated phenomena, codify the image to your liking. Use colored or shaped lines to represent indirect correlation, for example. Use different shapes around boxes to signify phenomena that are themselves outside of the scope of the field of study. That's what I'd do for personal use. For public, I'd simply add to it. Make it larger, more complete, but only the necessary information present.

Things like this are fantastic learning tools, when built and illustrated properly, which is why you might have seen so many in biology textbooks back in high school.

[Newbie]

14 uren geleden, Kuhnate zei:

It would be fair to say there should be a separate box off of magnetic fields. The modulation of things like north Atlantic Oscillation, el Nina / Nino, etc aren't shown. 

It is true what you say Kuhnate, provision could be made to include modulation of weather climatic events, the Indian Ocean Dipole being another example to add to the list. The Sun directly impacts the heating of the oceans, the movement of ocean currents and terrestrial winds driving the aforementioned events.

There are many more 'boxes' that could be added to this diagram.  😃

 

13 uren geleden, Christopher S. zei:

Well, as you said, fleshing it out would improve the information conveyed somewhat. The simplified version here is quite easy to interpret and digest - there is no complex information to it. Perhaps it would be useful to use this image to ease someone into the more complex version we're imagining here.

I can see such things having a home in college textbooks. Those will have charts and then some. Unfortunately however, they're expensive and the images within I believe can not be scanned and reposted elsewhere, legally anyways.

So, using the original chart above as a reference, if you care to create your own to practice your comprehension of the associations between the stated phenomena, codify the image to your liking. Use colored or shaped lines to represent indirect correlation, for example. Use different shapes around boxes to signify phenomena that are themselves outside of the scope of the field of study. That's what I'd do for personal use. For public, I'd simply add to it. Make it larger, more complete, but only the necessary information present.

Things like this are fantastic learning tools, when built and illustrated properly, which is why you might have seen so many in biology textbooks back in high school.

Fantastic idea thanks Christopher S.

Research on S-T-C (Solar-Terrestrial Coupling) deals with many aspects of the impact of solar wind and plasma on all layers of the Earth's atmosphere: surface to ionosphere. The arrows in the diagram tell us nothing other than that a relationship exists between the boxes. All that the boxes have is a label! Need to add so much more detail! I have other images and diagrams but unable to use them because of copyright/permissions. 

Have I opened up a can of worms?  😜

[Archmonoth]

9 hours ago, Newbie said:

It is true what you say Kuhnate, provision could be made to include modulation of weather climatic events, the Indian Ocean Dipole being another example to add to the list. The Sun directly impacts the heating of the oceans, the movement of ocean currents and terrestrial winds driving the aforementioned events.

There are many more 'boxes' that could be added to this diagram.  😃

 

 

I enjoy the Berkley information on absorption/reflection, perhaps it is useful for your list. Absorption / reflection of sunlight - Understanding Global Change (berkeley.edu)

 

Edited July 27, 2021 by Archmonoth

[Newbie]

7 hours ago, Archmonoth said:

 

I enjoy the Berkley information on absorption/reflection, perhaps it is useful for your list. Absorption / reflection of sunlight - Understanding Global Change (berkeley.edu)

 

Excellent diagram, thank you.